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Ep 399: Brett Steenbarger Interview with Michael Covel on Trend Following Radio

Brett Steenbarger
Brett Steenbarger

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My guest today is Brett Steenbarger, a Clinical Associate Professor of Psychiatry at New York State University, author of “The Daily Trading Coach,” “The Psychology of Trading,” and “Enhancing Trader Performance.” His newest work is “Trading Psychology 2.0: From Best Practices to Best Processes.” He is a trading coach, psychologist, author, blogger, and stock index trader.

The topic is trading psychology.

In this episode of Trend Following Radio we discuss:

  • The emotional “buy in”
  • Checklists
  • Finding a smooth equity curve
  • Repeated performance vs. deliberate practice
  • The role of fitness and health in trading
  • The moment of now
  • Systems trading vs. discretionary trader
  • Relationship between volatility and volume

“The fantasy of easy riches collides with the reality of what you need to do to prepare to win and I think that creates quite a dissidence for many beginning traders and ultimately leads them to leave the field.” – Brett Steenbarger

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Ep. 398: Investing and Sports Parallels with Michael Covel on Trend Following Radio

Investing and Sports Parallels with Michael Covel on Trend Following Radio
Investing and Sports Parallels with Michael Covel on Trend Following Radio

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Please enjoy my monologue Investing and Sports Parallels with Michael Covel on Trend Following Radio. This episode may also include great outside guests from my archive.

In this episode of Trend Following Radio:

  • Consistency vs. the home run
  • Quarterly performance
  • Trend following performance
  • Emotion in human nature
  • Irrationality in investing

“The market is made up of people and to beat it you have to know them as well as you know the thing you are considering investing in.” – Howard Marks

“The future ain’t what it use to be” – Yogi Berra

“Consistency and minimization of error has always ranked high among my priorities and they still do.” – Howard Marks

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What If I Were Starting Over?

Feedback in:

Good afternoon Mr. Covel,

I hope this message finds you well. My name is [Name] & I live in Sykesville, MD which is about 25 min’s south west of Baltimore.

I’m reaching out b/c I would like to learn how to conduct the research you’ve conducted & continue to do on trend following. I don’t know where to begin. Would you mind sharing what you would do today knowing what you know if you had to start all over again? Many thanks in advance for your time & thoughts.

[Name]

P.S. I love your podcasts!

I have actually put that here.


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Feedback in:

Dear Michael,

First off, I would like to thank you on the excellent work you have done. You should be very proud of your efforts. The courage you have shown at times is highly impressive.

I am not a particularly good writer, but I will try to keep this concise and accurate. I have been working in the finance area for roughly ten years, but until recently I didn’t know of you. In fact, I only discovered Richard Dennis and the turtle story a few years ago. I read up on them for a bit, then as daily work took over and whatever else, I never went back to them. I then lost my job, became pretty sick, moved country…well, a lot happened. I have always been surrounded by fundamental type fund managers and analysts, who never really wanted or asked my opinion, I was just their operations or trader guy. I never had the confidence to voice my opinion. Listening to conversations with lines like ‘China mobile is cheap at twelve times earnings’ or ‘I should really tweak my estimates slightly on mediatek’. The usual blah blah, by guys who only cared about beating their peers, despite meaning that could mean their clients losing money. While I never believed it, I never really took the time to seek an alternative way. I was generally more interested in sport. Also, I never had any kind of mentor. I know these sound like lame excuses, maybe they are.

To use your words Michael, I am ‘making a commitment to change’. My motivation is one for change in my life. I have consumed a lot of your work in recent months, mostly the books and podcasts (an outstanding service). I am very interested in purchasing your training program. I am more than humble to admit, I can’t turn things around without help and sound advice. I am not seeking a Holy Grail as mentioned on your site. I want to give myself minimum one year full effort and commitment, part of a plan to turn things around. Of course, it will hopefully be one year or many more.

About the program, I am concerned that I may wander off course, so to speak. There is a lot of reading material. Can I read that over time? Can I educate myself with the systems at the same time? I worry that without checkpoints along the way, the books will gather dust. I guess that is up to me. My capital for investments at the moment is relatively modest. I also worry that I should have more questions to ask, but don’t.

Thank you for your time. I am happy to call you if you have a spare five mins, I understand you are a busy guy. Email is more than fine.

Regards,
[Name]

Sure, we can talk. I look forward to the chat.

In advance of that call listen.


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

Also jump in:

Trend Following Podcast Guests
Frequently Asked Questions
Performance
Research
Markets to Trade
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Trading Technology
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Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

Trend Following is for Everyone

Feedback in:

My only beef with Michael is that he advocates long-term TF as a strategy for everyone. I only wished he would emphasize that long-term TF ‘works’ because of diversification (I believe he is very much aware of it; so, there is no need for him to be ‘told’ so) and would alter his message to include such. Otherwise, I think, he is a good source of information on long-term TF.

Thanks for the nice words, but TF is for everyone. Whether they invest with whatever fund, manager or DIY (futures, ETFs, etc.).


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

Also jump in:

Trend Following Podcast Guests
Frequently Asked Questions
Performance
Research
Markets to Trade
Crisis Times
Trading Technology
About Us

Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

“The more time I spend among humans, the more I love my dog…”

Listener: The Mona Lisa of them all IMHO. On my 5th listen!

Covel: Why?

Listener: Maybe its just me, but it struck a chord. The fact that average folks cannot equate to large sums of money is bang on. I mean if one spends there time looking for bargains at Walmart, how can they possibly comprehend millions let alone billions. The brainwashing and their ignorance prevents them from that. The Kevin Bruce story is simply amazing. What a humble human being. He understood what most never will at such a tender age that its all about the freedom and not the bling. Truly inspiring for the masses that want more out of life than the status quo or as I like to call it the neighbor quo!

Listener: David Harding calling the SPY a system, who the heck would ever have the courage to go on CNBC and tout that? The Godfather clip, inner confidence at its finest. As human beings we seek the answers everywhere but from within, where they truly lie. Truly inspiring and motivational at least for me, and this is coming from a guy who’s favorite quote is;

“The more time I spend among humans,the more I love my dog.”

As always thank you for what you do.

Covel: Thanks!


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

Also jump in:

Trend Following Podcast Guests
Frequently Asked Questions
Performance
Research
Markets to Trade
Crisis Times
Trading Technology
About Us

Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

“Why do people settle for mediocrity?”

Feedback in:

Michael,

First off, as an avid listener to your podcast I would like to thank you for the free content you put out to spread the trend following ideology. I have benefited from your content greatly, and know other like minded people have benefited as well.

As a recent graduate with an engineering degree I had a lot of trouble carrying out a buy and hold (hope) type investment strategy. It was a big mental conflict listening to the advice of financial advisors that recommended a strategy with mediocre returns and excess risk. Why does the media, efficient market theorist disagree with the that mentality hard work = results when it comes to the markets? Why do people settle for mediocrity?

Being relatively new to investing, and being the results driven person I am, after hours/days of researching different investment strategies, trend following caught my eye. A system that relies on the hard numbers (price) rather than opinions and blind predictions is exactly what I was looking for. Despite the poor timing for me to adapt a trend following type strategy (sideways market), I am no less confident in my strategy than the day I started, however this doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement.

As someone who exclusively trades stocks/bonds/etfs which of your books would you recommend for me to improve upon my system? I am already aware of the many trend following principles the turtles have used, i.e. position sizing, entry, exit…

Thanks again,
[Name]

I would try them all.


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

Also jump in:

Trend Following Podcast Guests
Frequently Asked Questions
Performance
Research
Markets to Trade
Crisis Times
Trading Technology
About Us

Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.