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The Journey of Turtle Trader Liz Cheval Took to Make Her Fortune

From Attain Capital Management:

In many ways, it can all come down to one decision- one choice in one moment that crystallizes a path in front of you. That path is rarely straight and often difficult to navigate, but once that moment has come and gone, the rest- as they say- is history. For Liz Cheval, chairwoman of the close to $150 million managed futures program EMC, that decision was the choice to respond to Richard Dennis’ famed turtle trader ad.

The story of the turtle traders [see my book The Complete TurtleTrader for more] is pretty fantastic in and of itself. Two renowned traders disagree. One says that what they do is unique, while another says that he could train anyone to trade. They make a wager on the issue, an ad is placed in the paper, and the lives of 20 students would never be the same. As the only female selected for the program, Cheval’s life was turned upside down.

After receiving a degree in mathematics from Lawrence University in Appleton, Wisconsin, Ms. Cheval was working as a trade clerk at the Chicago Board of Trade when Mr. Dennis placed his ad in the paper. At the time, women were few and far between in the famed Chicago trading pits. To hear her explain it, it was largely a function of physique.

“When I started on the floor of the CBOT in the early 1980’s… It was difficult for women to compete, given the physical demands of pit trading and the advantages of a larger, heavier frame,” she recalls.

It was on the floor that Cheval found herself drawn to Dennis’ offer. The excitement in the pits over the opportunity was palpable, as resumes were quickly refreshed and rushed to the mail. Cheval found herself being pushed to apply as well, even by those competing against her for a slot (including her employer). When called into an interview, she began to think that maybe she was missing something.

“As I approached the interview, I thought the opportunity with C&D was literally too good to be true,” she explains. “I simply couldn’t believe that a world renowned trader would teach us his methods and give us his private capital to trade. I assumed that there would be a catch, another story revealed at the interview.”

It turned out that the interview was simply the opportunity of the lifetime.

“It was not until the end of the interview, as Mr. Dennis’ top executive explained the nature and the details of the program that I began to believe it was the real deal,” Cheval recounts. “At that point, I became overwhelmed. My throat went dry. My legs were shaking. I could barely walk out of the room. If I understood the true nature of the program at the beginning, I would not have been as collected during the interview and would not have been selected. ”

Being selected may have been the easy part. After the interview began a rigorous amount of training, and the competition was fierce.

“The group was extremely competitive. The dynamic was open, above-board and collegial, but no doubt, everybody wanted to win,” Cheval states.

Even as the only woman in the group, Cheval found herself seamlessly blending into the adrenaline fueled atmosphere. The experience, by and large, was a positive one. She was able to earn the respect of her peers, and believes that working in a group of professional, competitive men helped prime her for professional challenges in the future.

When the training was done, it was time to hit the pavement running. The turtles were hungry to spread their wings and test their mettle. Cheval remembers making phone calls upon completion of the program, trying to gauge the level of interest for outside investors. That former employer who had encouraged her to apply? He became EMC’s first client, investing $1 million.

While it certainly has not been a bed of roses, Cheval has done very well for herself. EMC , which she runs with former turtle Brian Proctor, now has $148.75 million in assets under management, and is as well respected in the industry as you can get, in our opinion. She credits the nuanced strategies involved in managed futures with keeping her in the game. Even with this success, Cheval knows that you need to keep pushing to make it in this industry.

“The ability to adapt to change is the key to long term success in trading. It’s relatively easy to develop a profitable trading strategy over a short time frame. It’s far more challenging to develop a reliable method to continually adapt the strategy to future market conditions,” Cheval states.

Adaptation is especially important in an environment like what is seen today. Managed futures seems to be perpetually under attack by mainstream media pundits and financial advisors, with the bulk of comment being directed toward “greedy speculators.” This misconception, paired with investor frustration over a divergent return stream and increasing government intervention in the markets, can complicate the managed futures conversation, but Cheval is up to the task. In her mind, the theory of the game makes the challenge all the more worthwhile.

Her experience in the industry has granted her a great deal of perspective, and she’s more than willing to share it. The secret to becoming a successful CTA? She’s not keeping mum.

“You need both a successful trading strategy and, more importantly, a reliable method to adapt the strategy to future market conditions. A successful trading strategy requires robust systems and sound risk management principles. The trading strategy is only as good as your research process. You have to identify robust estimators and develop a process to continually adapt the systems based on these reliable estimators,” Cheval says. “You have to be disciplined in executing both trading and research strategies, in good periods and bad. A CTA has to be committed to their strategy whether it is in or out of favor.”

And for all you women out there thinking about entering the field?

“Over the years I encouraged women to manage money because I believed it to be a gender neutral occupation. No one can dispute your contribution based on gender in investment management. Your performance is there in black and white in the P&L report,” states Cheval.

“Go for it. Today the physical advantage of men [in the trading pits] is inconsequential because trading is virtually 100% electronic. I give the same advice to both men and women seeking entry level jobs in managed futures. Technical skills are mandatory. Great thinkers and idea creators need technical applications to test and execute trading strategies. Having those skills is a great way to gain entry or to build your own business.”

However, in our conversations with Cheval, it was her comments on the future of the industry that resonated with us most.

“Money centers will shift, performance will change, but overall, global markets are large and expansive,” she quipped. “Markets and managers will adapt.”

We couldn’t agree more.

Unfortunately, Liz Cheval recently passed away, but her success lives on.

Related Podcasts and Articles:

Trend Following Forward by Charles Faulkner

Lobster Logic

Interview with Brennan Dunn

Learning Trading Mechanics

Trend Follower Cliff Asness


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Passing of Elizabeth Cheval the Founder and Chairman of EMC Capital Management

Sad news:

It is with great sadness that I report to you the passing of Elizabeth Cheval, the Founder and Chairman of EMC Capital Management. Liz was highly regarded by her peers throughout the managed futures community and recognized as one of the leaders of the industry from its earliest stages.
John C. Krautsack
Managing Director
EMC Capital Management, Inc.

A legendary trader from the Turtles.


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Going The Extra Mile and Trend Following

Do you really want to be in a box with millions of traders and investors with the same training, technique and style (i.e. fundamentals, forecasts, buy and hold, talking heads, etc.)? Richard Dennis danced to a different beat and his creation of the Turtles landed him in the hall of fame. Dennis relayed one of his quirks that helped set him apart:

“I used to go to bed with a book of charts,and just flip through them before I went to sleep. I wasn’t trying to analyze or interpret them, just retain them so that my mind could work on them while I slept.”

Who knows if this exercise worked? What matters is that he was so fired up about being great and forever improving, that he was OK with experimenting and trying out new new things. What will you do differently today? Ludwig von Mises nailed it:

“The class of those who have the ability to think their own thoughts is separated by an unbridgeable gulf from the class of those who cannot.”

True that.


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

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Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

Richard Dennis Offers Sound Day Trading Advice

For every ten traders that try their luck at day trading nine of them will go broke. It is just the way the game works. Famed trader Richard Dennis had this to say about day trading:

If I’m buying and selling in the same day, it’s always to take a loss. I haven’t made a profit on a day-trade in five years.

Having a plan and sticking with it is also something Dennis stood by in his day trading advice:

“When you have a position, you put it on for a reason, and you’ve got to keep it until the reason no longer exists. Don’t take profits just for the sake of taking profits. You have to have a strategy to trade, know how it works and follow through on it.”

Without a solid plan, and the nerves to stick with it, the markets will exploit you, take advantage of you, and then in a sad quiet fashion…. leave you for broke on the side of the road.

Richard Dennis Tutle Traders Books
Be sure to read my book, the Complete Turtle Trader, to learn more on how Dennis led the Turtles to great success using the Trend Following method.

Find out more about the Turtle Traders.


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

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Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

Thanks Again for Your Wonderful Wake-up Calls

Feedback in:

Hi Michael, I have started to read your books about 6-9 months ago, and bought the only one I was still missing last week-end! I still have to complete reading of this last one, currently ‘digesting’ the various readings, while I have to fully grasp all the learning into a structured thinking of mine. Over the past 6 months I have also started to seriously listen to your podcasts and trying to catch-up with the long list of great insights. I like your personal way of thinking/speaking: incisive, clear-cut, no unnecessary compromise. Your message goes out loud and clear. Thanks for this fantastic array of shared knowledge! You have clearly influenced (directed?) my belief in price and trend following as the methodology that all successful traders use. I am now a firm believer of ‘taking charge’ and I believe ‘Trend Following’ is the way. I am still struggling a bit to put a system in place. I want to purchase one of your systems, but I am not sure which one. My sons are more knowledgeable in dinosaurs than I am, but not your types of dinosaurs! This morning, I was catching a bit on podcasts and heard you will be in Singapore later in February. I would love to meet you face-to-face. Based on your insights, I would also like to understand why in your opinion, despite using the same system described in your books, the ‘turtles’ did not all have the same amount of success: different leverage? less discipline to follow the trading signals? Do you short the exact same way as you ‘long’ the market?, etc. I am really looking forward to meeting with you in Singapore,
Very best regards,
Patrick

P.S. Two words on me: I am a French national, living in Asia with my family for 8+ years by personal choice. I successfully started a joint-venture in India 8 years ago (but unfortunately did not get shares of it… ), then have been the MD of [name] in Malaysia for 2 years, and have now been developing business in Asia for [name], based here in Singapore. My personal story with the finance industry is not different than the one of many others when it comes to ‘investing/trading’. I initially thought that, as for other Industries, trusting the professional investors was the safe bet, to my greatest disappointment. Trust in banks and pensions funds has eroded with the bad years to the point where I went into reading/listening to make my own decisions. Which is where I am now…Thanks again for your wonderful ‘wake-up calls”!

Thanks! We will try for a Singapore meetup once my schedule firms.

How and why did Turtles have differing levels of success? That is a main component of my book on their story. Take a read!


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

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Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

“The overwhelming fact is that this thing that shouldn’t have worked has worked for 30 years.”

An excerpt:

To see how trend-followers aren’t all about rocket science, take one of the forefathers of today’s fund managers: Chicago-based trader Richard Dennis. In the 1980s, he made a bet with a rival that successful traders could be taught, that it wasn’t an innate talent. As part of the contest, Dennis taught a breed of traders he called ‘Turtles’ because he trained them to lock into specific market trends and ride them, just as turtles ride sea currents. What was important was to decide on a system and stick with it. The approach lends itself to computerized dealing, because in it, trades are often triggered by the dynamics of the market itself. A classic example is the moving average. Track the five-day moving average of a stock and, some traders believe, you should buy where it crosses above the 30-day average or sell when it falls below. Such ideas can be converted into an algorithm that tells a computer when and how to trade. The turtles’ edge, like trend-followers today, was in exploiting the reality that mainstream economic theory doesn’t allow for: financial markets don’t behave efficiently, but follow vogues and panics. “The overwhelming fact is that this thing that shouldn’t have worked has worked for 30 years,” said Harding over lunch at his local West London Italian restaurant. Computers don’t need to be persuaded to hold firm when the market turns against them.

Well stated.


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

Also jump in:

Trend Following Podcast Guests
Frequently Asked Questions
Performance
Research
Markets to Trade
Crisis Times
Trading Technology
About Us

Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.

Richard Dennis: The TurtleTrader Teacher

Richard Dennis

More information about Richard Dennis Trader.


How can you move forward immediately to Trend Following profits? My books and my Flagship Course and Systems are trusted options by clients in 70+ countries.

Also jump in:

Trend Following Podcast Guests
Frequently Asked Questions
Performance
Research
Markets to Trade
Crisis Times
Trading Technology
About Us

Trend Following is for beginners, students and pros in all countries. This is not day trading 5-minute bars, prediction or analyzing fundamentals–it’s Trend Following.