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The Two Female Turtles: Liz Cheval and Lucy Wyatt

As I mention in my book there were two female Turtles. This was news to many as the lone female Turtle for all these years had been positioned as Liz Cheval, but my research showed that to be incorrect. Lucy Wyatt Mattinen was a Turtle as well. And it was other Turtles who were the source of confirming Wyatt Mattinen’s Turtle existence. But like everything with the Turtles there was a more detailed back story!

I state in my book that Cheval elected to not speak for “The Complete TurtleTrader”. She did, however, email me during my book writing process:


Thanks for the email and voicemail. I appreciate you contacting me. Could you clarify a couple of things for me? Are you the original founder of the TurtleTrader website? I know it’s changed quite a bit over the years. I think it’s a great resource. Just wasn’t sure if you were the original founder and if so, and do you have any contact information for Russell Sands and other turtles. Rich asked me to put together a list for him and I think you have more up-to-date information than I do. I would appreciate a list of email addresses or other contact information on as many turtles as you have.


Worse than Cheval saying “no” was not even being able to find Lucy Wyatt Mattinen to ask her for an interview during my book writing process. However, once the book was published I quickly heard from Wyatt Mattinen. She was incensed that she was described as “doing her nails” by another Turtle. In no uncertain terms she educated me about her long time involvement with Rich Dennis and Bill Eckhardt. She laid out her trading successes. Clearly, Wyatt Mattinen, while not an active fund manager today, has lived an interesting life. While she did not agree with the “nails” comment she did state in no uncertain terms that my book was bullseye accurate

However, little did I know I had stirred the pot by declaring that there were two female Turtles. In fact, my article in Trader Monthly revealed the unexpected. Trader Monthly, in verifying my article details with Cheval, was told by Cheval that she was the only female Turtle. Trader Monthly stood by the notion of two female Turtles and referred to “women” in the article.

Why all of the detail? There are quite a few who are interested in the Turtle back story. For example, once my book galleys, the drafts, started making the rounds, feedback from one person in particular struck a chord. Bob Pardo is a seasoned trader. He is also a skeptic, the kind of person you want to read your book in order to understand the weaknesses. Pardo does not believe in praise as much as constant improvement. And, although his bluntness probably rattles many, his honesty was welcomed.

Pardo confronted me with a number of questions postulating why some Turtles were averse to talking and he wondered if there weren’t further lessons to be drawn from Dennis’ managed money efforts. He also saw the apparent paranoia from some Turtles as interesting and worthy of further exploration. So in many ways the back stories I have posted are in response to the likes of Pardo and many others who have asked questions since my book’s release.

More to come.

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